Seat Height coupled with a Short Rider

[mikego_34]

Hello all,

I currently am looking into an RC 390, i've been riding a ninja 300 for about a year now. My only concern is the seat height. I am 5-8 with shoes on so probably 5-7. Basically I am curious if any short riders can share there experience on riding an RC 390. Was the seat height so high that your feet couldn't reach the ground? I've sat on other 32.7 inch seat height bikes and dont feel very comfortable, will I likely get the same experience on this bad boy. I know the the seat width also matters given that it takes away from your inseam.

Thanks in advance.

 

[A1VW2NV]

I'm 5' 7 1/2 and have no problems. I can't flat foot it, and I'd like to lower it about 15mm but It's not that bad.

 

[ToraTora]

Outside of doing things like shaving the seat (and there isn't much to shave), don't lower the bike. Messing with the suspension that way introduces issues that are hard to deal with inexpensively, and even with a lot of money it still isn't easy.

It's much better to either a) learn how to ride so that when you stop you slid to one side of the bike to put a foot down, or b) just get a different bike with a lower seat. But remember most of the MotoGP guys are tiny little jockey like cats riding huge monster bikes. You can learn how to ride without having to put both feet on the ground. In these videos you'll see riders that can't even put one foot on the ground. Seriously!

[video=youtube;uekU93Dgj-E]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uekU93Dgj-E[/video]

[video=youtube;A-GcGjQXwoA]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A-GcGjQXwoA[/video]

[video=youtube;vYDBCeJg4bk]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vYDBCeJg4bk[/video]

[video=youtube;LscPyTU0JHM]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LscPyTU0JHM[/video]​

 

[mikego_34]

I'm 5' 7 1/2 and have no problems. I can't flat foot it, and I'd like to lower it about 15mm but It's not that bad.

Can you at least tippie toe it?

 

[My Retro Career]

I'm 5'6" and with a short inseam.

My previous bike, RSV1000R, had an 810mm seat height. This RC390 has an 820mm height. Yet, the Aprilia felt taller because the KTM has a narrower seat and softer suspension.

And much less weight at that.

The rear suspension setup on my RC390 is still on the 3rd setting; I've still to experiment with the firmer "sport" ride.

I ride with my Doc Martens; oddly enough, I'm not really on tippy toes when at a stop. A little pass my toes, yes, but nothing uncomfortable nor intimidating at all, unlike, say, the R1, which stands at 33.5"

At 5'7", you'll do just fine.

Tora2 is right; the top 4 MotoGP riders' heights are:

Lorenzo 5"7"
Marquez 5'6"
Rossi 6'0"
Pedrosa 5'2"

Of course, riding on the streets require much more contact on the ground than GP racers do. But you get our point.
If you are to climb over and make a switch to a "taller" bike, there's possibly no better one than a lightweight RC390 to start with

 

[ToraTora]

In Contact

Of course, riding on the streets require much more contact on the ground than GP racers do. But you get our point.
If you are to climb over and make a switch to a "taller" bike, there's possibly no better one than a lightweight RC390 to start with

And by that you mean with feet, rather than knees and elbows, right?

 

[A1VW2NV]

Can you at least tippie toe it?

I can rest with the ball of my foot when stopped.

 

[Treachery]

Excellent posts.

I'm 5'7" and change, 29+" inseam. If I think about it, the bikes I've owned that I could actually flatfoot were:
1970 Honda CD175
1994 Suzuki Bandit 400
2011 BMW F800R, but only with the low saddle
In between are a lot of tall ones, including a 1975 BMW that I managed to raise by nearly an inch when I replaced the fork springs and didn't anticipate the effect of the preload spacer.

Everything else I've either had to tip-toe, or I've just managed it by getting one foot solidly down. If you're attentive, and plan your stops, you'll both be fine, and you'll get better at being observant and planning. You'll also eventually manage to put your foot down into midair. The nice thing is that the RC is light enough to catch.

So, jump on in there!

 

[Arahant]

I'm 5"5 and I'm fine. I can put tippy toes down on both sides. But obviously more comfortable with one foot down and foot on the peg on the other side. I'm thinking about trying to get a slightly shorter seat though.... also the guy at the dealer messed with the rear shock so when I throw a leg over at the beginning, it goes down abit... not 100% what he changed but its probably obvious to the more experienced riders here. It only took him like 2 minutes to do so it can't be anything to dramatic.

Unfortunately the stock seat doesn't look like it has much foam to shave as its kinda curved upwards, so the actual seat doesn't seem to be more then 1.5-2 inches thick. Still the frame where the seat rests on it probably at least 3" shorter then top of the seat.

The biggest problem I have is trying to reverse the bike while sitting on it, especially if there is any sort of incline or something on the ground.

 

[ToraTora]

Yeah there's not a lot of foam to remove on that seat!

What he did was reduce the preload on the shock so that it would collapse more when you got on it. Preload shouldn't be set to rider height, but to rider weight. Again these methods to accommodate height almost alway negatively effect the handling of the bike--many times in dangerous ways.

 

[Arahant]

Yeah I should really take it to a specialist do you think? if I took it to a specialist they could likely set up the suspension so that its lower but so that it doesn't negatively effect the ride geometry... correct? possible even improve on it with some high quality aftermarket parts?

 

[Treachery]

YMMV, but I'd leave it alone. The bike isn't overly blessed with clearance, so if you lower it (even with the same geometry, if that's possible), you're going to be that much closer to touching the pegs down. And the exhaust header if you mount the Akra or similar.

 

[Formula390]

Yeah I should really take it to a specialist do you think? if I took it to a specialist they could likely set up the suspension so that its lower but so that it doesn't negatively effect the ride geometry... correct? possible even improve on it with some high quality aftermarket parts?

Nope. That'll change the geometry. That changes the handling. Will it mean it'll put you in the ditch on a decreasing radius turn from levering a tire off the tarmac from grinding hardparts... maybe. It's certainly a better chance of happening than if you DIDN'T change he geometry. If you can get one tippy toe down, that's enough. One racer I used to ride with on the street was 5'2" and he'd have to hang a butt cheek off one side of the seat and get a tippy toe down at lights. That little bastard was crazy fast. It may not seem the most natural at first, but honestly, you do NOT need to flat foot both feet. You don't even need to flat foot ONE foot. Don't try lowering it tho. It's a recipe for disaster.

...and if you do, I call dibs on your motor if you do put it into a ditch and total the bike.

 

[ToraTora]

Yeah that's the rub you mess with these things it messes up the bike. That said some racers do put a slightly longer rear shock on the bike to make them turn a little bit quicker, or allow for more preload--depending on what the engineer is trying to achieve.

Now, what you could do is cut off the sub frame and build a lower one. This wouldn't change the geometry, but it could effect the center of gravity. If you haven't had a bunch of physics, and some good engineering skills I wouldn't suggest doing this one either.

 

[Formula390]

Yeah that's the rub you mess with these things it messes up the bike. That said some racers do put a slightly longer rear shock on the bike to make them turn a little bit quicker, or allow for more preload--depending on what the engineer is trying to achieve.

Now, what you could do is cut off the sub frame and build a lower one. This wouldn't change the geometry, but it could effect the center of gravity. If you haven't had a bunch of physics, and some good engineering skills I wouldn't suggest doing this one either.

Raising the rear will quicken turn in and add instability. If you aren't having high speed stability issues, then no problem. I added a 1/2" spacer to almost every one of my bikes for the rear... My gixxer 1000 turns in so quick it has scared a few guys I let ride it who were used to riding their same model year gixxers. I haven't ever taken it up over 165mph and don't race it tho.

--- as for cut and weld up the frame????!!!!!

Riiiiiiiiiight! "So you say you don't like to tippy toe, so I'm going suggest you hack up and rebuild the FRAME!" LOL Never mind the welding skills required to do that right, much less the potential for catastrophic failure. I know, you're joking, but dude, some folks will take you seriously on that sorta thing.

Honestly, if it's that big a deal, get a Duke. It's got a lower seat height.

 

[Arahant]

So now you guys got me thinking if I should try and put the settings back to normal from what they were stock.... I do like it sinking in abit when I first sit on it, I notice after I'v been riding abit its also alot better... when I get on it cold for the first ride of the day it feels a little stiff as it sinks down... but when I get on it again after making a stop it sinks down right away...

I dunno honestly I"m ok with how it is now and I'v gotten used to only being able to touch with my tippy toes... but I don't want to be riding with a messed up geometry...problem for me as a new rider I dont have anything to compare it to really... so I can't really tell how messed up the geometry is, I"v been able to get the bike pretty low in corners going decently fast... I'v hit bumps and pot-holes in the road going decent speeds and it feels fine.... but like I said I wouldn't know if it was actual making a big difference in a bad way. Maby I should start to slowly put it back to normal bit by bit, you guys think thats the best way to go?

Also interesting idea about the duke, its abit late for me now but I thought for sure it was a higher seat height not lower, I just looked it up and sure enough your right... generally speaking I thought those sort of upright riding position bikes had higher seats then normal bikes(sport). I guess what threw me off was I had researched the duke 690, as a potential next bike once I"m ready to upgrade from the 390, as the riding position is a little tiring for a newbie rider... but the seat height on the 690 is 34"-35", so quite abit higher then the RC 390. And abit to high for me.

 

[JKBC]

I lowered mine 30mm and now I love it.

Yes...I was on my tippy toes and didn't want to fall over eventually at an angled stop somewhere. < What might that cost...and to your ego if there were spectators?

...Now I have both feet flat on the ground at stops...I can even raise my butt off the seat to get more comfortable then.
KTM's dirt-bike history shows in giving these little street bikes such high seats. However they do fit tall riders well according to most road tests.
Clearance is no problem...I wondered about speed bumps in parking lots but it isn't a problem....and looking at it from the front (lowered) I'd think if I ever touched a foot-peg then it would only be because I was about to lay it down.

Look at yours and wonder about the claims of some to have touched pegs at the stock height....safe to say those claims are bull and the same people probably stuff a salami in their pants to think they'll entice girls on the dance-floor.

I got the lower shock mount which lowers the bike and you also raise the forks through the triple clamps as instructed here KTM Lowering KIts
...they make a 30 and a 60mm lowering shock mount and 2 shorter side-stands which you also will need. Yes it isn't cheap but they're charging accordingly to recoup their design/R&D and obviously they aren't going to have a million customers.

 

[onethump]

I'm 5'8 and have no issues even on uneven roads when stopped. Sometimes it feels kind of low actually.

 

[aperk]

I just bought an RC 390 about 6 weeks ago and this thread caught my eye because I am barely 5' tall with boots on! I did need to have my bike lowered by the dealer, which brought it down about an inch. I still cannot touch the ground with both feet. There is a KTM lowering kit for the RC and Duke...I'm not sure if that was used or if another solution was used (I didn't care...I just wanted the bike!) but I can give the exact details on parts/procedure for anyone who's interested. A shortened side stand was included.

I would like to have a little more height taken off just so I feel more comfortable on the street so will try to remove as much from the seat as possible. Definitely don't want to drop that baby. I've thought about getting sliders/frame protectors just in case of a mishap. I'm really careful about where and how I park the bike and where I stop at lights and stop signs. Usually just try to keep balance and not put feet down at all if I can get away with it. And I have to get off the bike to back it up. Oh well, not that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things.

My previous bike was an '03 R6 which was also lowered. Had no problems with it and was even able to ride an unmodified Suzuki SV650. So, short riders can definitely manage. For me it's a matter of knowing what I can and can't do and finding ways to work around that.

 

[Willasan]

Look at yours and wonder about the claims of some to have touched pegs at the stock height....safe to say those claims are bull and the same people probably stuff a salami in their pants to think they'll entice girls on the dance-floor.

I regularly drag my stock peg feelers. To keep it honest, I have lowered the front end about 5mm, and I'm still running the OEM shock. I'm only about 180-185 pounds in full kit. I imagine the shock has a lot to do with it though.