WERKES USA EXHAUST for the KTM390 Photos, Videos, and More - Super Sleak Look

[Sacape2]

Once again I have quoted you above where you very clearly state that the exhaust "makes great torque improvements". Did you not state this?

I am merely pointing out that it is impossible to increase torque unless you increase power, which is precisely what you have stated above.

I am ok with the exhaust not producing any additional power.

I get the benefits claimed which are:
You save a Ton of weight. Fact.
You save a Ton of Heat (your shock will thank you) Not sure this has been proven, but ok.
You get a great looking exhaust. Agreed.
IT's OEM Fit and OEM Look. Agreed
And it Sounds great. Definitely sounds better on the videos provided. Keep in mind that a lot of tracks are starting to enforce 103db sound levels (Jennings 103db, PIR 103db, Laguna is 90db and possibly soon NCM at 103db) and if you are getting 94db at 8000rpm I wonder what it will be at when running at 10,000rpm?

I would pull the trigger on this exhaust if there were any power benefits to it at all but it doesn't appear that there is any evidence that there is. I am only asking if anyone has any data that shows this. If they did I would order it today as I am just as interested in function as I am form and never plan to have mine on track.

I'm not trying to play Devil's Advocate right now.

I think you might have misunderstood what he said. Making torque improvements doesn't mean gains. Looking at the charts, it seems like the exhaust (mated with PCV and WBC) has smoothed out--"improved"-- the power delivery. That's how I took it when I first read it.

 

[A1VW2NV]

Once again I have quoted you above where you very clearly state that the exhaust "makes great torque improvements". Did you not state this?

I am merely pointing out that it is impossible to increase torque unless you increase power, which is precisely what you have stated above.

I am ok with the exhaust not producing any additional power.

I get the benefits claimed which are:
You save a Ton of weight. Fact.
You save a Ton of Heat (your shock will thank you) Not sure this has been proven, but ok.
You get a great looking exhaust. Agreed.
IT's OEM Fit and OEM Look. Agreed
And it Sounds great. Definitely sounds better on the videos provided. Keep in mind that a lot of tracks are starting to enforce 103db sound levels (Jennings 103db, PIR 103db, Laguna is 90db and possibly soon NCM at 103db) and if you are getting 94db at 8000rpm I wonder what it will be at when running at 10,000rpm?

I would pull the trigger on this exhaust if there were any power benefits to it at all but it doesn't appear that there is any evidence that there is. I am only asking if anyone has any data that shows this. If they did I would order it today as I am just as interested in function as I am form and never plan to have mine on track.

You are just full of contradictions aren't you. You post track DB limits, yet you state "I never plan to have mine on track". WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR AGENDA?? Either this exhaust is for you, or it's not! Buy it, or don't. Thousands bought the Akrapovic system without ever seeing a dyno chart, and I have every reason to believe you'd do the same. I find it odd that nobody questions all the crap noise makers out there, or demands dyno charts for them. As for the Werkes exhaust being cooler than the stock system, next time you finish up a ride, stick your fingers between the spring and the muffler. Report back, please! That's just simple thermodynamics.

 

[dobr]

You are just full of contradictions aren't you. You post track DB limits, yet you state "I never plan to have mine on track". WHAT EXACTLY IS YOUR AGENDA?? Either this exhaust is for you, or it's not! Buy it, or don't. Thousands bought the Akrapovic system without ever seeing a dyno chart, and I have every reason to believe you'd do the same. I find it odd that nobody questions all the crap noise makers out there, or demands dyno charts for them. As for the Werkes exhaust being cooler than the stock system, next time you finish up a ride, stick your fingers between the spring and the muffler. Report back, please! That's just simple thermodynamics.

How am I full of contradictions? I merely stated that this exhaust is as mentioned by numerous posters "very loud" and that may preclude others from being able to ride at certain tracks but it won't matter to me as I don't plan to have mine on track. Hence it doesn't figure in my decision on whether to purchase one or not.

Additionally I want to know whether the exhaust provides any performance gains as some have said but not yet provided any proof. I'm not like everybody else and won't just throw money on an upgrade that isn't worth it. I have spent more than most people on this website to improve their RC390. Excuse me for asking a tough question. I kind of thought that the forum was for questions like this and discussion back and forth.

As for the exhaust being cooler due to simple thermodynamics would you care to elaborate because I am interested in why?

 

[cornerslider]

Can everybody just take a deep breath...... 19 pages of bickering? Cutting to the chase- it's loud, and the "seat-of-the-pants dyno" seems like there are probably some gains. Some people like it, some don't. The RC is still a one-lung 390cc bike..... There is only so much you can do to get power out of it- just saying'.....

 

[psych0hans]

I think someone got seriously butt hurt because you basically insulted their girlfriend... Lol I understand brand loyalty, what I don't understand is people getting so butt hurt and aggressive about a brand which isn't even their own... So what if he wants numbers and Hp figures to support their claim? Is it a crime to know what you're paying so much if your hard earned money for? Crazy...

 

[HardRacing]

I think someone got seriously butt hurt because you basically insulted their girlfriend... Lol I understand brand loyalty, what I don't understand is people getting so butt hurt and aggressive about a brand which isn't even their own... So what if he wants numbers and Hp figures to support their claim? Is it a crime to know what you're paying so much if your hard earned money for? Crazy...

.

LOL​.
You are correct. It's bizarre how this thread has turned from.. "Hey here's a new exhaust, we think it looks good, it factually saves weight, sounds great, you lose the Cat. so you reduce heat...etc.....etc.. "

And now we have statements of ......... "I need multiple Dyno Charts to support their claims."

Who are "they" ?

Werkes USA has never made any claims on power.

We've never made any claims on power.

Sure a few customers may have said.... "It feels better" or " it feels faster" ........ ok, so what....?

No one has ever made any claims.. or stated "This exhaust makes xyz more power then stock . "

The fact remains there are a bunch of exhausts for this bike and from what we have seen, NONE of them make any more power then stock. If the do, it's like 1 hp.
Some exhausts brands have even been reported lose power, or add weight or both ....etc.. .

That's why it's never been a big deal for this WERKES Exhaust. Because, it does everything else, and does it well..

So If someone is waiting to "back up those claims" .......... Claims that no one ever made. They are going to be waiting a long time.

This exhaust isn't for everyone.

That's why there are options to choose.


.

 

[reenmachine]

Ok I'll attempt to change the subject.

Have any photos of it on a bike with a race bellypan?

 

[A1VW2NV]

I think someone got seriously butt hurt because you basically insulted their girlfriend... If you're referring to me, I am not butthurt. Annoyed? Yes. Lol I understand brand loyalty, what I don't understand is people getting so butt hurt and aggressive about a brand which isn't even their own...Aggressive? lol I have zero affiliation with Werkes. I happen to like their design because it is the best option for me at this point. So what if he wants numbers and Hp figures to support their claim? Several others commented previously, yet he kept asking. Is it a crime to know what you're paying so much if your hard earned money for? Apparently he can afford more than most of us on this website, so $550 shouldn't be a problem, should it? Crazy...

dobr, as for the comment about this exhaust being cooler on the shock, here's the simplest analogy I could think of;
Stand 2ft from a campfire, hot yes?
Now back up 4ft. Much cooler, no?

 

[Rexbo]

Ok I'll attempt to change the subject.

Have any photos of it on a bike with a race bellypan?

I have the answers! And don't judge my garage, after finishing the bike I cleaned it. The pile of stuff in the back is all my roommates', I swear.


As for bickering... I have an appointment next month to get it back on the dyno again to fix some 50% to 80% throttle fueling and just to make you kids happy, I'll put the oem exhaust back on, remove the PCV and put in the OEM air filter and get those baseline numbers.

And to be clear, if I were to start building my race bike again, I'd still pick this exhaust over anything else on the market right now.

 

[dobr]

I have the answers! And don't judge my garage, after finishing the bike I cleaned it. The pile of stuff in the back is all my roommates', I swear.

As for bickering... I have an appointment next month to get it back on the dyno again to fix some 50% to 80% throttle fueling and just to make you kids happy, I'll put the oem exhaust back on, remove the PCV and put in the OEM air filter and get those baseline numbers.

And to be clear, if I were to start building my race bike again, I'd still pick this exhaust over anything else on the market right now.

I am pretty sure that the baseline numbers on a RC are available already. I would be more interested in just putting the stock exhaust back on, tune it and then make a run. That will give you a good baseline. Then install the Werkes exhaust, tune it and make a run. Then you have a reliable baseline on the first graph and the gains will show in the second graph. That will definitively tell everyone what gains the pipe provides. Making anymore changes for the baseline will just muddy the waters.

 

[green_bread]

As for bickering... I have an appointment next month to get it back on the dyno again to fix some 50% to 80% throttle fueling and just to make you kids happy, I'll put the oem exhaust back on, remove the PCV and put in the OEM air filter and get those baseline numbers.

And to be clear, if I were to start building my race bike again, I'd still pick this exhaust over anything else on the market right now.

It would be AWESOME of you to take the time to do that and provide some real world numbers. As long as the exhaust makes around the same power as the stock one, Im happy with the huge weight savings. People also need to keep in mind that this is one of the only exhausts for the RC thats less than $700, too.

Your bike is looking good, Rexbo! Pretty similar to what mine should look like very soon!

 

[Sacape2]

I am pretty sure that the baseline numbers on a RC are available already. I would be more interested in just putting the stock exhaust back on, tune it and then make a run. That will give you a good baseline. Then install the Werkes exhaust, tune it and make a run. Then you have a reliable baseline on the first graph and the gains will show in the second graph. That will definitively tell everyone what gains the pipe provides. Making anymore changes for the baseline will just muddy the waters.

Not all dynos are calibrated (or cal'd at all) the same, so it would make a better stock baseline comparison if he did it himself and compared it to his tuned/modded results. To get his best results, it would behoove him to eliminate any possible variables such as someone else's baseline done in different conditions to compare it to.


Granted, his bike and mods aren't 100% replicable. I'm not saying results are arbitrary, but they are conditional.

 

[dobr]

Not all dynos are calibrated (or cal'd at all) the same, so it would make a better stock baseline comparison if he did it himself and compared it to his tuned/modded results. To get his best results, it would behoove him to eliminate any possible variables such as someone else's baseline done in different conditions to compare it to.


Granted, his bike and mods aren't 100% replicable. I'm not saying results are arbitrary, but they are conditional.

I think that what we are looking for here is how much is gained from just the exhaust. If he does what he says, "I'll put the oem exhaust back on, remove the PCV and put in the OEM air filter and get those baseline numbers" then we know how much was gained with all his other mods, not just by adding the Werkes exhaust. You are almost going to have to run a PCV or some other kind of fueling adjuster to run this exhaust so that is pretty much a given. That is why I say he should make a run with all his other mods and stock exhaust. That gives a consistent baseline. Then put the Werkes exhaust on and make a run. The gains can be completely attributable to the exhaust and nothing else. The only reason I mentioned that we already knew the stock numbers was because I hate to see someone go to a lot of effort to find out something we already know or within a small variable of difference between dynos. Now if he wants to see how much his changes have gotten him exactly that is a different story.

 

[psych0hans]

People also need to keep in mind that this is one of the only exhausts for the RC thats less than $700, too.

Your bike is looking good, Rexbo! Pretty similar to what mine should look like very soon!

You really need to do more research on the different systems available

 

[psych0hans]

I have the answers! And don't judge my garage, after finishing the bike I cleaned it. The pile of stuff in the back is all my roommates', I swear.
View attachment 2261

As for bickering... I have an appointment next month to get it back on the dyno again to fix some 50% to 80% throttle fueling and just to make you kids happy, I'll put the oem exhaust back on, remove the PCV and put in the OEM air filter and get those baseline numbers.

And to be clear, if I were to start building my race bike again, I'd still pick this exhaust over anything else on the market right now.

You Sir, are the shizzles... lol & Your bike looks sexy in white... Good luck with the racing

 

[psych0hans]

dobr, as for the comment about this exhaust being cooler on the shock, here's the simplest analogy I could think of;
Stand 2ft from a campfire, hot yes?
Now back up 4ft. Much cooler, no?

All I'm trying to say is you're taking this way too personally and seriously. It's a public forum and if someone has a question or an opinion, just let them voice it, I don't feel the need to criticize someone just because they are looking for some answers... Peace

 

[green_bread]

You really need to do more research on the different systems available

I really do... it was just a general statement. Ive just seen the Akra ($899), the Yoshi ($719 or $899), the Arrow XCone ($764... I know they have a couple other cheaper slip ons, though) that are the most common, so thats what I was comparing to. Im working on building the suspension and race prepping, right now. Exhaust will probably be one of the last mods I do since there are more gains to be had in other areas.

 

[Rexbo]

Dyno time is $80-100/hr... I'm not going to pay for a tune with the stock exhaust, though that would be interesting in terms of results. Reality is that I don't care enough to spend another couple bills to get a tune for a setup I'll never run (except maybe at laguna seca...) in addition to the tuning I'm already doing.

If someone else wants to spend the money, have at it.

Also, found a huge bonus over the yosh exhaust: if someone is putting your bike on/off paddock stands while the bike is on, it's not belching exhaust directly into their faces!

 

[Dick_Justice]

I am extremely interested in this exhaust. After reading all through this thread and talking to people on Youtube who have this exhaust I am at a confusion point. Is it 100% that i need to get the PC and Wideband to run this exhaust? A few people I've talked to say they are running it fine on the stock ECU with neither.

 

[SneakyOwl]

I am extremely interested in this exhaust. After reading all through this thread and talking to people on Youtube who have this exhaust I am at a confusion point. Is it 100% that i need to get the PC and Wideband to run this exhaust? A few people I've talked to say they are running it fine on the stock ECU with neither.

"Running fine" is one thing. Running optimally is a whole other deal.
Of course it will run, but as it has been stated in this thread the bike seems to run very lean, which in the long term isn't good for the performance or the heat production in the engine.

Especially if you take the decat in mind. This exhaust eliminates the stock catalysator, which in 99% of the cases will need a new map to run optimally (this goes for any bike/car).