My 2017 did not have the lean symptoms that other people report, no part throttle surging, no running hot (south Florida). with the cat delete pipe installed it did not run any different...the noise level with the stock pipe did increase, and the closed loop fuel mileage dropped a little. It did not seem to run any hotter as it is a street bike and was in closed loop mode. After 3 weeks I installed the Power commander V with the mod map, and the wide band 2. after 2 weeks I have noticed it runs smoother at lower rpms and has better throttle response .( I filled in the tables for the WB2). Thanks to Hard Racing for their help.
2017 RC390
2006 Derbi GPR125R
2005 Raw ZX6RR
better is the enemy of good
Formula 360
First of all thank you for attempting to educate me. If my goal were ultimate performance, I would tune it with a dyno and analyzer right now.
I accept that you have much more knowledge than me on this topic. But you have to respect my skepticism about the horrible lean condition. IÂ’ve owned 35 motorcycles and had to correct plenty of lean fueling conditions...both with a carburetor and FI. ALL of those lean conditions created SYMPTOMS. Backfiring, surging, unstable idle, etc etc etc.
IÂ’m not using a butt dyno for Power assessment so that comment isnÂ’t really relevant but people quote it all the time.
IÂ’m just really having trouble understanding how asymptotic lean conditions are going to ruin my life[emoji56] You, yourself state the bike runs lean from the factory and yet parts arenÂ’t blowing all over the roads around the world. Also, aftermarket fueling schemes make a lot of money for a lot of people...including you...no offense...and that fact needs to be expressed in this conversation.
Remember, all I did was install a Leo Vince link pipe. No intake mods and stock exhaust. Also itÂ’s a road bike that gets a few trackdays a year under a fairly slow and conservative old guy.
Right now IÂ’m still waiting for a rational, evidence based argument as to why it is mandatory that I change my perfectly functioning, asymptotic fueling. So far all I have is quotes from the journal of handwaving [emoji48]
Finally, in those years of 35 bikes I have been down the fueling rabbit hole enough to know that better is the enemy of good[emoji85]
So I take it you have the understanding of open and closed loop control?
[FONT="]Closed Loop systems usually operate at low throttle openings (below 20%) and below 50 to 60% of max RPM. Above those throttle and RPM points the system goes back to Open Loop operation, running off the fuel maps stored in the ECU.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The RPM at which the Closed Loop / Open Loop switch happens is generally determined by the maximum speed reached during the test cycle, how hard the vehicle has to work during said test and the chosen gearing for the vehicle. This is why changing final drive ratios (sprocket sizes) is considered breaking the law – it changes the vehicle form how it was homologated.[/FONT]
[FONT="]The throttle position at which the Closed Loop / Open Loop switch happens is generally determined by the relationship between engine size and the size of the throttle bodies, and by how much load (and therefore throttle angle) the test requires the engine to provide. Cruising at 100km/h on a 900 – 1000 Ducati 2V engine with 45mm throttles will see a throttle angle around 10 degrees, whereas on a 4V of the same capacity with 50mm throttles will be around 8 degrees. Not a big difference, but as all the Ducati 2V engines run the same 45mm throttles you can see the difference 620cc will give as compared to 1000cc.[/FONT]
[FONT="]To show this a little more clearly IÂ’ll show a fuel map with approximated switching values, with the Closed Loop section in green and the Open Loop section in blue. This is a 916 std fuel map, but itÂ’ll do just fine for now. As you can see, the idle is also controlled by the Closed Loop system. The logic is simple - RPM and throttle inside green zone: Closed Loop, RPM and throttle outside green zone: Open Loop.[/FONT]
FUEL MAP (milliSeconds)
THROTTLE degrees