Now that I'm finally riding the bike...

[psych0hans]

Hi guys, I finally managed to get some time to take the Hulk out and stretch her legs a bit... Did a 100 mile round trip, up the mountains, to enjoy the twisties... All I can say is WOW! The bike is really amazing for what it is and I totally loved riding it. It's really peppy and totally flickable thanks to its uber light weight. It does have it's flaws, but nothing MAJOR and nothing that some light modding can't iron out. Some pros and cons...

Pros : -
1) Peppy Engine, almost instant torque and power.
2) Light weight, very flickable.
3) Uber fast, don't feel like I need a bigger bike at all.

Cons : -
1) Uber vibey engine, gets tiresome after some time.
2) Brakes. Definitely need to upgrade at least the pads.
3) The Seat of this bike is torture! It's even worse than the Ninja 250r seat, and that's saying something.
4) Bike is very jerky at low revs, maybe a fueling problem.

Here is a list of things I want to get done to her PRONTO...

1) Brakes... Definitely brakes... Initially I thought the brakes were fine and didn't need to be upgraded too soon, but I've changed my mind. It's really lacking the bite I'm looking for and the bike takes it's time to slow down. I didn't find any problem with the master cylinder, as the pull is nice and firm, so I'll start with changing the pads and take it from there.

2) New grips to reduce the vibes.

3) Reworked seat to make it comfortable.

4) Remapping to try and improve fuelling.

5) I increased preload on the rear shock because it was hitting the poorly constructed speed breakers while riding two up, seems to have helped.

6) Zip Tie mod to reduce throttle pull.


Will keep adding miles and reporting the updates here...

 

[MrGrody]

Hi guys, I finally managed to get some time to take the Hulk out and stretch her legs a bit... Did a 100 mile round trip, up the mountains, to enjoy the twisties... All I can say is WOW! The bike is really amazing for what it is and I totally loved riding it. It's really peppy and totally flickable thanks to its uber light weight. It does have it's flaws, but nothing MAJOR and nothing that some light modding can't iron out. Some pros and cons...

Pros : -
1) Peppy Engine, almost instant torque and power.
2) Light weight, very flickable.
3) Uber fast, don't feel like I need a bigger bike at all.

Cons : -
1) Uber vibey engine, gets tiresome after some time.
2) Brakes. Definitely need to upgrade at least the pads.
3) The Seat of this bike is torture! It's even worse than the Ninja 250r seat, and that's saying something.
4) Bike is very jerky at low revs, maybe a fueling problem.

Here is a list of things I want to get done to her PRONTO...

1) Brakes... Definitely brakes... Initially I thought the brakes were fine and didn't need to be upgraded too soon, but I've changed my bike. It's really lacking the bite I'm looking for and the bike takes it's time to slow down. I didn't find any problem with the master cylinder, as the pull is nice and firm, so I'll start with changing the pads and take it from there.

2) New grips to reduce the vibes.

3) Reworked seat to make it comfortable.

4) Remapping to try and improve fuelling.

5) I increased preload on the rear shock because it was hitting the poorly constructed speed breakers while riding two up, seems to have helped.

6) Zip Tie mod to reduce throttle pull.


Will keep adding miles and reporting the updates here...

Just curious about your opinion on the braking system. How aggressive are you engine braking while down shifting. I ask because with my Rc390 brakes seem stellar, but I aggressively engine brake as well. Nice write up. These bikes are a dream. And yes the seat is a brick lol

 

[psych0hans]

Just curious about your opinion on the braking system. How aggressive are you engine braking while down shifting. I ask because with my Rc390 brakes seem stellar, but I aggressively engine brake as well. Nice write up. These bikes are a dream. And yes the seat is a brick lol

I don't think I'm using TOO much engine braking while braking... If that makes sense... I do use engine braking to slow down, but not while I'm on the brakes. The time taken from pulling the lever to the bike actually slowing down to an acceptable pace takes too long and the bike travels too far to do it. I can also hear a squealing noise when this happens. Maybe it's the ABS? I'll try riding tomorrow with the ABS turned off for a comparison.

 

[MrGrody]

. I do use engine braking to slow down, but not while I'm on the brakes. .

Ah. Ya I could imagine stopping using just brakes takes forever. All my bikes I've own and all my riding I've always combined engine braking and brakes from whatever speed all the way down to about 20mph. So from let's say 60mph I guess I'd be in 5th maybe or 4th. I'd engine brake the entire gear while on the brakes all the way thru 2nd gear.

Most likely why I'm stopping with plenty of "braking power"

 

[Asher]

The brakes certinally are crap from factory. I haven't replace my pads yet as I'm having trouble actually finding a supplier.
Personally find the levers too far from the grips and I have to really reach to grab them, I have brought adjustable levers which help.

 

[ArkansasDave]

Cjwell is a forum sponsor and has brembo pads. I haven't had any issues with the brakes on the street or during my races. On the street I had abs enabled and it was fine. For the races I disabled it and it was fine. Only thing I noticed was it took a little more effort than my r6 to get the same amount of braking.

 

[Asher]

I'm a pretty hard braker on both road and track and I really think these brakes majorly lack bite, feel and power. Especially since they are meant to be designed by Brembo.
I think the main issue is the pads, not sure if Ktm wanted to save money here or didn't want to put powerful brakes on a learner bike I don't really know.
While turning The abs off the soft front forks probably don't help with hard braking.

 

[guzz46]

Someone on this forum, I can't remember who, took his pads out and found they weren't wearing evenly, I think only the centre of the pads were making contact with the disc, maybe there's quality control issues with the pads and you got one of the bad sets?
The brakes are powerful on mine, they don't have the same aggressive bite like the Brembo's on my old Husky did, but I got used to that pretty quick.

 

[Formula390]

There seems to be pretty wildly difference of opinion about the quality of the brakes. I find mine to be very good. Are they are good as the dual rotor rolling stoppies capable front end of my Gixxer 1000... certainly not, but MORE than capable of stopping the RC at any speeds it's capable of hitting. You can run HH sintered pads to be sure... with as cheap as the front rotor is from KTM having to replace the rotor every 3-4 years shouldn't be a big deal from rotor wear and HH sintered pads. I however am still running the stock pads. What I DID find tho, was that I needed to bleed the brakes! The first time I triggered the ABS (just fooling around and testing it out) the brakes got REALLY mushy like there was suddenly an air bubble in the system. I did a full flush and bled the brakes at the caliper and the master cylinder, and bingo, they were great. So it might be something just as simple as KTM isn't flushing the lines, or there is a small air bubble in the ABS unit that needs to work it's way out, or they might be just using crap fluid. It says DOT-4, but I use DOT-3 in everything I run without any problems. I also flush my brakes every other year at least... I try to do it every year, but with as many bikes as I've got, I'm sure I'm occasionally skipping a year on some of them as that's a bit of the maintenance I don't track/log.

So offhand, I would say if you think the brakes are crap then:
- First.: Bleed them! You should do that at the very least, or if you have a a mighty-vac then just go ahead and flush them. If you DON'T have a mighty-vac, FFS, get onto eBay and GET ONE already!
- Second: Make SURE they are bedded in well. Take your pads out, hit them with some 60 grit sandpaper in case there is any glaze or contaminants on them, then put it back together, take it for a ride, and BED them pads in WELL!
- Third: If that doesn't solve your issue, inspect your freshly bedded in pads for wear and make sure the caliper is working correctly and that you are getting even wear.
- Lastly: Consider going to HH pads. Just know, that these pads WILL wear your rotor, so if you run HH's know you'll need to replace your rotor probably every 2 or 3 sets of pads.

The brakes on my RC are really quite good. My weight (220# ish) is probably what's keeping me from saying they are great. Is that single rotor ever going to be 1 finger stoppie at speed capable... nope. Is it capable of hauling you down from near triple digit speeds to cornering speed with just 2 or 3 fingers in a small amount of distance traveled, certainly.

For the folks ripping out their ABS system and going to braided lines, that's a waste of effort and funds. $0.02. I think the ABS system is phenomenal and performs WAY better than I ever expected it to. It certainly contributes to the brakes not being AS good as they could be, but there is still plenty of power in them and there's just no way anyones brand new lines are flexing enough to warrant replacement to braided lines. We aren't talking about early 80's rubber lines here which have been subject to decades of sun and use. If you think your brakes suck, it's almost certainly going to be nothing more than the fluid being crap or you've got air in the system somewhere... with the possibility that there may be some contamination on the pads. This could possibly just be that some brake fluid was spilled on them at the factory while doing the initial bleeding. Then maybe the caliper seals are sticking so you aren't getting even wear, and thus you aren't getting even power delivery from the level to the pads to the rotor.

 

[Formula390]

Cons : -
1) Uber vibey engine, gets tiresome after some time.
2) Brakes. Definitely need to upgrade at least the pads.
3) The Seat of this bike is torture! It's even worse than the Ninja 250r seat, and that's saying something.
4) Bike is very jerky at low revs, maybe a fueling problem.

1) Vibey Engine: Uhm. What? No... check your motor mounts to make sure they are solid and torqued. This is a pretty smooth engine.
2) Brakes suck: Bleed them.
3) Seat is torture: It's a KTM. They ALL suck. Eat more biscuits and nature will take care of the padding for ya'.
4) Jerky: Define "low rev jerk" please. It's a single. I don't know what mapping the India bikes come with, or if y'all are getting the same craptastic US EPA map on the street bikes. Offhand, I would say get thee to the dealer and get the Akrapovic map installed.

Here is a list of things I want to get done to her PRONTO...

1) Brakes... Definitely brakes... Initially I thought the brakes were fine and didn't need to be upgraded too soon, but I've changed my mind. It's really lacking the bite I'm looking for and the bike takes it's time to slow down. I didn't find any problem with the master cylinder, as the pull is nice and firm, so I'll start with changing the pads and take it from there.
2) New grips to reduce the vibes.
3) Reworked seat to make it comfortable.
4) Remapping to try and improve fuelling.
5) I increased preload on the rear shock because it was hitting the poorly constructed speed breakers while riding two up, seems to have helped.
6) Zip Tie mod to reduce throttle pull.

1) Changing pads isn't where to start. Bleed, flush, and inspect for contamination and even wear.
2) Uhmmmm. Don't death grip the bars so tight. This may also be the "vibey engine" issue. The grips are fine. My guess is you are holding the grips too tightly. I mean... you ARE riding around on the streets of India, which is certainly going to be more chaotic and stress inducing that bombing around back country roads here in the US, but spongy pads aren't going to fix an issue you are having with gripping too tightly.
3) Eat more Biscuits.
4) This would be #2 on my list, but yeah... get that done ASAP.
5) Check your static and rider sag. Riding two up is going to handle like crap unless you're setup for it, but you're talking at least what, 100# difference in weight on the bike between you alone and two up. The stock spring is crap, and isn't going to handle that well at all. The amount of preload you put on it for with a passenger is going to result in your static sag being gone. Zero. Nadda. It also means your rider sag is going to be off for when you are riding alone. Just make sure you aren't adjusting the bike for two-up riding at the expense of it being setup well for you riding solo. You'll spend far more time riding solo, and you want the bike to handle best like that... unless you intend to find a good setup for both and swap between the two. I setup my bikes for me alone, and just know it's gonna handle... less than optimally... when I've got the wife or girlfriend on the back of the bike.
6) LOL. Don't be such a big baby. Reduced throttle pull?! That's something that made the list as an issue??? Really?! You still need to have free return when the throttle is let go so that it goes all the way to a closed throttle. How about the lights suck, or the fan is always running, or the lack of a heat shield for the primary header is cooking your left leg, or or or or... there are plenty of things that could be improved.

 

[psych0hans]

Hi Matt, as always, thank you for your reply.

1) I assure you, I've seen TWOT II several times and know not to have a death grip on the bars. The only time I find myself really squeezing the life out of the bars is when I'm panic braking, other than that I tend to keep my hold pretty light. I'm sure it's just the nature of the single that's causing the vibes. They aren't TOO much of an issue, but something that would get tiresome over time, especially on longer rides.

2) I'm not sure bleeding will solve my problems as the squeeze at the lever is pretty firm and not at all mushy. I did intend to bleed the brakes before I actually started riding, having read a lot about how correct bleeding helps solve many braking issues, but after riding I didn't think it was needed. I will check the pads tho and maybe go over them with some sandpaper.

3) I added a gel cushion on the seat, but that makes it uber tall, adding more than an inch to the overall height. Will be reworking the seat in the near future.

4) At low revs the throttle response is jerky, abrupt even, but smooths out in the higher revs. I don't know if the Akra map is available in India, so I'm going to do a "soft reset" or whatever its called by letting the bike idle for 15mins. Hope that will help.

5) Will check sag numbers today itself, meant to do it much sooner, but just been lazy.

6) The throttle isn't TOO much of an issue, but I thought I would take care of it anyway, something I've been obsessing over even before I started riding. Yeah, I'm OCD!!!

About the other issues you mentioned : -

1) The light's don't suck? I'm in India, so I get a single low beam and dual high beam setup. I also have a set of replacement LED bulbs which I will install if needed. I also have not done a lot of night time riding, so I'm probably not equipped to answer this properly.

2) Now that you mention it, I have been feeling a heating issue on my left leg, but it's not something unbearable. We are currently using a particular stick on heat shielding material to cover a part of the exhausts we supply to our customer here, I'll try sticking some of that stuff on the exhaust to see if it helps.

3) I'll take things as they come and solve one issue at a time to judge the benefit of the action taken.

4) Also, I believe that the bike comes stock with steel braided lines, Please correct me if I'm wrong... I know the duke does, as the outer casing is transparent.

 

[psych0hans]

Another update after putting some more miles on the Orange Hulk...

Hi guys, it's time for another update on the Orange Hulk. I'm thoroughly enjoying riding her and she's totally an awesome bike. That being said, there are some issues which I need to get seen to, sooner than later. I had installed a radiator guard on the bike, which involved removing the original splash guard installed and installing the radiator guard behind it. This has led to some rattle noises and increase in vibration noise, I'm assuming, thanks to lose bolts? Also the bike is really jerky at low revs, so I'll have to have the fueling taken care of as well.

Another more important issue which probably needs attention first is the brakes. I was almost satisfied with how the brakes originally functioned and didn't feel the need to change anything too soon. This changed as soon as I changed my levers. The Initial bite became hard and the pull became much better. I was getting awesome feedback and braking as soon as I started pulling on the lever. This, I now realize, was thanks to an incorrectly installed brake lever, which jammed on me while riding yesterday. Luckily, this happened at a stop light and I wasn't standing in the middle of the road. I couldn't move my bike an inch after that. Luckily, my bike had it's toolkit and after some roadside DIY, I managed to reinstall the lever and free the brakes. The problem is, now the brakes have become the opposite, it's gone from having a viagra induced hard-on, to a 90 year old shriveled up d**k... The lever pull is mushy at best and any level of braking only comes after pulling the lever dangerously close to the bars... I'm planing on replacing this with an OE brembo unit, probably a PS16 or something similar.

Ducati Brembo 16mm Rec PS16 Front Brake Master Cylinder Pump Silver Lever | eBay

This is the most economical one I could find, also it's not likely to have any clearance issues, unlike the radial ones, which most certainly will.

Another aspect I want to work on is the suspension, I'm not doing the RC8 mod yet, as I don't want to risk my stock suspension. I'll use the heavier springs and oil that I have and hope for the best. Once I buy an extra set of forks, I'll try the RC8 mod with those. For the rear, I'm looking at buying a used penske unit for an R1 and installing that. I also have a stock R6 unit with me, but I'm not too sure about installing that till I rebuild it. Also, it will need a much heavier spring, as the 390 doesn't have a linkage.

p.s. I will be taking Matt's advice first and bleeding my brakes properly.

She Hulk

 

[psych0hans]

Another minor update, did the "zip-tie" trick by tying my brake lever to the bar overnight and checked in the morning. It seemed to have reduced the mushiness by a good margin, will need to confirm after a short ride.

 

[big_sur]

I'd be surprised if a new master helps much without removing the ABS since you're still working through 20ft of brake line. I'm happy with the braking performance with just HH pads and ABS removal so I might just bleed the brakes and add HH pads to see if that's enough for you.

 

[psych0hans]

Post my recent fiasco with the brake lever jamming on me, I decided to drill out the bore hole which pushes the master cylinder piston. I bored it out by about 1.5 mm using an 8mm drill bit in a drill press. I held the lever in my hand and sort of just pushed it up into the drill. I made 3-5 passes removing between .2-.4mm each time. This made the difference I needed and my brakes are much better now. Still a little mushy, but not alarmingly so. Also, I think some of the mushiness has got to do with the huge amount of play in the levers. Something I'll sort out next.

Another minor but significant mod I made was to have a layer of gel added to the seat. I no longer have to walk funny after any amount of riding and that made it totally worth it. A friend did it for me and only charged me about 40$ so it wasn't too pricey.

 

[gbabyracing]

Change the pads now. SBS, Vortex, EBC, or Brembo. The stock pads have terrible quality control if they ever properly bed in it will take for ever. Ours would only bed an area less the size of a quarter.

 

[psych0hans]

Change the pads now. SBS, Vortex, EBC, or Brembo. The stock pads have terrible quality control if they ever properly bed in it will take for ever. Ours would only bed an area less the size of a quarter.

I'll definitely do that next. I have a friend who sells SBS pads, so that's what I'll go in for. Thank you for your input.

 

[gbabyracing]

We are running SBS now and find them to be very good.

 

[psych0hans]

Hi guys, apologies for the huge gap between updates, but I've just been plain LAZY... No other way to put it... Let me just wrap up what I have done to the bike since my last update.

1)Clip ons + Grips + Mirrors install - I received and installed my set of chinese clipons, messing up the whole process, because I bought the wrong set of clipons, more details here. Along with the clipons, I also installed the bar end mirrors and orange grips. This whole session of mods was a disaster for various reasons... The Clipons didn't work well and now, thanks to the mods I made to them, have a certain degree of "play" in them, meaning I can physically move the bars up and down while they are still attached. I have ordered a new set, but this is all I have till they come.
Wrong Clipons

Correct ones

The grips are too hard and get annoying after a while, but they did reduce vibrations considerably. Also the extra rubber in the grips can get painful after a while. That being said, they don't look too shabby, but will still be replaced with a set of red driven gel grips.

The mirrors were a set of cheap ebay bar ends like the pic below. While being of a decent enough quality, the rubber bush supplied wouldn't fit into my bars(don't know who to blame here) so had to be ground down. Once they WERE installed, they were quiet bad, as the mirror quality wasn't up to the mark and it was flat, giving a very limited field of vision.

These were replaced by another set of cheapo chinese mirrors, but this time of much better utility, as they are convex and have a much bigger surface area than the other ones.
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2) Fender Eliminator, LED Turn signals, powertronics, Air Filter, Brake Bleed - Last week I dropped off the bike at the service center to have some work done to it, this included installing the powertronics I purchased used for about 130$, an eBay K&N rip off air filter, LED strips to replace the mirror turn signals and my fender eliminator kit. I also had them bleed my brakes for me.

The powertronics has made a huge difference to the bike and it no longer has that jerky throttle response at low revs. It's also a much smoother ride overall and has made riding the bike a more pleasurable experience. I'm not sure what difference the Air Filter made, because I think it probably flows as much air as the stock one.

The Fender Eliminator kit looks pretty awesome on there. I bought mine in anodized orange to keep with the orange theme of the bike. I'll probably get rid of the rear turn signals as well and go with the LED strips, some time in the future. Contrary to what was posted earlier(in the RC390 Forums), the LED strips don't flash faster than the stock mirrors signals and work perfectly in conjunction with the rear LED lights.
[RESIZE]

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I'm not convinced the service center actually bled my brakes, because it feels pretty much the same. Also, now that I come to think of it, they haven't even charged me for any brake fluid, so now I'm certain they didn't bleed the brakes. I'll call the owner of the center and let him know.

Also, in case you're wondering, the entire bill from the service center for the work done was a grand total of 13$ US. Yep, all hail cheap labor...

 

[psych0hans]

Hi guys, I did some more upgrades to my bike recently and here's a review of each of them...

Something that I was very eager to do on my bike, was the quick turn throttle mod. For this I sourced about 4 different after market throttles and eventually landed up using the same one as DCMoney. Super short throw and looks good to boot. Did I mention it comes in orange too? lol




After doing some night time/early morning riding, I could see a need for some extra lumens to make riding safer. Installed a pair of 10w CREE LED lights where the mirrors used to be. Works like a charm and I like the unique positioning of them too. Something I picked up from another forum.



Also added a USB charger, not used it yet, but I figured something like this it's better to have and not need than need and not have...



Next mods will be RC8 forks and complete braking system upgrade, including Master Cylinder, Calliper, Lines and Rotor. RC8 forks will need new springs and oil soon enough, as the stock springs are too stiff for me and I'm sure the forks will be over damped for the 390, so some lighter weight oil should do the trick. I'm thinking of a mix of 2.5w and 5w in equal amounts, giving me approximately 3.75w. I'm still trying to figure out a way to install the R1 shock, not going to give up so easily, especially considering I have upwards of $500 invested in it.