raise or drop frontend for track?

[mdabyo]

I have read a few places that people drop the front end. Thought i would see what others do? on my r6 i always had the front dropped about 10mm but was wondering what other do as a starting point for the Rc. first track day here is about 2 weeks away and i am madly trying to get the bike finished. Just installed the Andreani fork cartridges this morning.. was not bad at all if you have the proper tools!

 

[Fangfactor]

Interested to hear peoples thoughts on this as well

With the Andreni install, do you need to separate the bottom of the leg where the brake and axle attach from to the chrome tube?

If so Ive heard its pretty tight with a lot of loctite. Did you need heat and special tools? and whats the procedure?

Ive had my forks apart to add preload so have dismantled to that point . Just wondering if the bottom can be separated without specialised tools.

Thanks in advance

 

[CDN Duke]

I just swapped springs and needed to remove the fork ends to get at the black 50mm spacer that's held in place by an o-ring.

You'll need a 43mm clamp to hold the chrome stanchions. I bought Chinese clip on mounts from eBay, they were perfect. The bottoms are regular thread, not reverse as I misstated previously. You need to heat up the ends to loosen the Loctite and you can use the front axle as a lever.


These are what I bought, the 'riser' version so you have something to hold in a vice.

CNC Fork Tube Clip Ons Handlebars Head Mount Regular/Riser Motorcycle Universal

 

[Fangfactor]

I just swapped springs and needed to remove the fork ends to get at the black 50mm spacer that's held in place by an o-ring.

You'll need a 43mm clamp to hold the chrome stanchions. I bought Chinese clip on mounts from eBay, they were perfect. The bottoms are regular thread, not reverse as I misstated previously. You need to heat up the ends to loosen the Loctite and you can use the front axle as a lever.


These are what I bought, the 'riser' version so you have something to hold in a vice.

CNC Fork Tube Clip Ons Handlebars Head Mount Regular/Riser Motorcycle Universal

Thanks Mate, Just what I needed to know Thats a great idea with the clip on mount. i just mounted a set of the same ones on the bike (51mm)

In Australia Andreani cartridges dont seem to be stocked by the suspension shops but Matris are and make a set to suit the RC390.

Now you've got me thinking

 

[andysodandy]

@mdaybo Did you end up dropping them 10mm and how was it?

I dropped ours 7mm but to be honest it is still like wood up front and does not want to turn into any corner without effort. Once in the corner its like its on rails. I'm wanting to raise up the rear some but as this is the mrs bike for me its always going to be squatting in the rear as its sprung for 75kg when im 105kgs suited.

Definitely does not turn as i thought this bike would

 

[mdabyo]

dont get out till next Friday, i am going to drop it one line as a starting point (about 5mm) i think and go from there.. I have the back end raised a little as well.

 

[isaac_]

I installed GP suspension cartridges and a Jri rear shock. We dropped my forks flush with the caps to give me the most trails. I think it and the bike turns.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[andysodandy]

Is the JRI shock much higher than the stock?

I would be keen to try the R6 shock with more pre-load but there is no chance to adjust it with the c-spanner as there is no room to use it. I will have to remove the shock first to do it.

I do love the bike but it is simply the worst turning in bike I have owned. It feels like the front is glued to the road and just does not want to turn in.

maybe ill try and dump the front another 10mm and then maybe it might want to turn

 

[isaac_]

Is the JRI shock much higher than the stock?

I would be keen to try the R6 shock with more pre-load but there is no chance to adjust it with the c-spanner as there is no room to use it. I will have to remove the shock first to do it.

I do love the bike but it is simply the worst turning in bike I have owned. It feels like the front is glued to the road and just does not want to turn in.

maybe ill try and dump the front another 10mm and then maybe it might want to turn

I'll have to look at my notes. I want to say the JRi would allow you to increase ride height. I just don't remember by how much.

I'm surprised to hear you say the bike doesn't want to turn. I think quite the opposite. But then again I'm going back and forth between this and an SV so I feel the difference and it is drastic.

I think that dropping the forks will add mid corner stability because it's adding trail. But raising the forks should give you the flickability you might be looking for. It's a balancing act. That said. Out of the box these don't have much trail to begin with so I'd rather muscle it down if it means I'm not skittish at the apex.

The other thing if you're struggling turning the bike is to move your bars out to add leverage. This is assuming you've got clip ons.

 

[micahpearlman]

I'll have to look at my notes. I want to say the JRi would allow you to increase ride height. I just don't remember by how much.

I'm surprised to hear you say the bike doesn't want to turn. I think quite the opposite. But then again I'm going back and forth between this and an SV so I feel the difference and it is drastic.

I think that dropping the forks will add mid corner stability because it's adding trail. But raising the forks should give you the flickability you might be looking for. It's a balancing act. That said. Out of the box these don't have much trail to begin with so I'd rather muscle it down if it means I'm not skittish at the apex.

The other thing if you're struggling turning the bike is to move your bars out to add leverage. This is assuming you've got clip ons.

I have a race only 390. I run the GP Suspension cartridges with the caps just above the triple clamp (about 5mm). Also run the JRI shock and it is height adjustable and I have it ~8mm over stock -- I've messed around with it a lot trying to get a compromise of ground clearance vs. rear wheel coming up in hard braking. I'm not complaining too much about the turn in but it *could* be a bit faster and with a bit less muscle -- but I'll take the really great mid-corner stability any day and vow to work a little harder at the gym. I know a lot of very fast racers raise the front and lower the rear (still as high or higher then stock) but I have never been totally sure why and no one has been willing to talk about it -- maybe as stated above about getting better rake or better hard braking performance.

 

[isaac_]

I know a lot of very fast racers raise the front and lower the rear (still as high or higher then stock) but I have never been totally sure why and no one has been willing to talk about it -- maybe as stated above about getting better rake or better hard braking performance.

On the RC specifically? I know on my SV, my fork height (sticking above the triple) is 15+mm and that is so that it can tip into corners faster. I can also do that on the SV because there's plenty of trail. Lowering the rear is a way to add trail as well; however, I don't think that's a good way to do it. It's like riding a chopper at that point.

 

[micahpearlman]

On the RC specifically? I know on my SV, my fork height (sticking above the triple) is 15+mm and that is so that it can tip into corners faster. I can also do that on the SV because there's plenty of trail. Lowering the rear is a way to add trail as well; however, I don't think that's a good way to do it. It's like riding a chopper at that point.

Yeah on the RC a lot of fast guys do the "chopper" setup -- Ari Henning reportedly being one at least at one point but I didn't look closely at his bike this past weekend so he may have changed it. I agree it totally sounds like the wrong direction to me -- but they certainly aren't dumb or slow and know one will really explain the why behind it, but I don't push people if they don't want to volunteer. *shrug*

I'm happy enough with the direction I'm going with my setup and was putting down some good lap times last weekend racing. I was just chiming in that my setup (GP cartridges with Penski shock with Pirelli SC) seems to be working well but I was just thinking that turning in feels heavier then I would expect and I ran across this thread. Though, I have to also say that the mid-corner stability is beginning to break down a little over this last weekend as I'm getting the first signs of chatter as I'm starting to get some decently fast lap times.

 

[isaac_]

Yeah on the RC a lot of fast guys do the "chopper" setup -- Ari Henning reportedly being one at least at one point but I didn't look closely at his bike this past weekend so he may have changed it. I agree it totally sounds like the wrong direction to me -- but they certainly aren't dumb or slow and know one will really explain the why behind it, but I don't push people if they don't want to volunteer. *shrug*

I'm happy enough with the direction I'm going with my setup and was putting down some good lap times last weekend racing. I was just chiming in that my setup (GP cartridges with Penski shock with Pirelli SC) seems to be working well but I was just thinking that turning in feels heavier then I would expect and I ran across this thread. Though, I have to also say that the mid-corner stability is beginning to break down a little over this last weekend as I'm getting the first signs of chatter as I'm starting to get some decently fast lap times.

Keep dropping the forks.

I know at least one racer local that had the chopper set up. His explanation for his issue was that the bike wanted to oversteer. And the chopper set up helped him with that.

 

[micahpearlman]

Keep dropping the forks.

I know at least one racer local that had the chopper set up. His explanation for his issue was that the bike wanted to oversteer. And the chopper set up helped him with that.

Nah, I'll just work harder at the gym. What I'm searching for now is better hard late braking. It's finding the balance of rear end coming up vs ground clearance vs preserving a certain desired geometry.

I dunno if oversteer is ever a problem on these bikes -- there is another explanation, but hell if I know. And I'm not one to get too adventurous with radical setup changes -- I'm a click at a time guy...